What Healthy Masculinity Is (And Isn’t): Brant Hansen

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What Healthy Masculinity Is (and Isn’t)

Guest: Brant Hansen

From the series:What Healthy Masculinity Is (and Isn’t) (Day 1 of 2)

Air date:September 26, 2024

Brant: You might be jacked. You might spend three hours a day in the gym. You might be handsome. You might have all the coolest stuff. If you make your wife feel insecure because you are there, she’s not attracted to you. I read one guy saying, “Yes, I used to pat myself on the back for being somebody who would defend the home if I had to. Then I realized most of the time the intruder is me.”

Shelby: Welcome to FamilyLife Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I’m Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.

This is FamilyLife Today!

Dave: We’re going on the water today.

Ann: Yes, we are.

Dave: We’re going out on the boat on the cruise.

Ann: Everyone should go with us on the water.

Dave: Yes, we’re talking about the Love Like You Mean It® cruise that we were on last February. We’re going to hear a talk today from one of our favorite-ever guests on FamilyLife Today, author and speaker, Brant Hansen.

Ann: This is going to be really good and you’re going to enjoy it. But before we start, we want to encourage you, if you haven’t already signed up for the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise, today is your day.

Dave: Yes, you don’t want to miss going this year on the cruise. We’ll be there. We’re actually giving a keynote. It’s a great week to relax but it’s also a great week to work on your marriage.

Ann: Yes, it is.

Dave: To sign up [go to] FamilyLifeToday.com. Just go to FamilyLifeToday.com, sign up for the Love Like You Mean It cruise, and you’ll hear talks like this from, like I said, Brant Hansen. This was the talk he gave to men. We had a men’s break out split session and a women’s and this was Brant talking to the men.

[Recorded Message]

Brant: If you ask people in our culture, “Define masculinity,” they can’t. They will [say], “There’s toxic masculinity.” Okay, got it. We shouldn’t use our strength and power to be toxic to overwhelm people. But what’s the good side of it, distinctly good? Even churches I’ve found, guys, can’t articulate that: “What’s distinctly masculine and good?”

They’ll say, “Well, it’s masculine to follow Jesus.” True. That’s women, too, but what’s distinctly masculine that’s beautiful? Unfortunately, I’ve been part of church groups where they can’t say it. What is it? We need to have something, some vision for masculinity.

That’s what this book is about. I think maybe I’m the right guy to write this because I’m not good at hunting, I’m not good at other stuff like that. Because there has got to be something deeper than just “It’s a men’s group so we’re going to study the Bible and then have steak.”

Steak is awesome. Don’t get me wrong but there has got to be something deeper, more masculine than that because some guys are accountants, some people are professors, they’re—we all have different jobs. We’re not all hunting in the woods every day. What does masculinity look like in your context right where you are? This is what was weird, when I went to college, they had a Christian women’s house, and they gave us a tour around there. At the time, every girl’s room had the same poster in it. It was really weird. This is the best-selling poster of all time. It’s called “L’Enfant.” I thought, “Okay, I know that guy is good-looking. I’m sure. But why is it in every room?

I asked one of the girls in college “What’s up with this guy? What’s up with this photo of this guy?” She said, “Oh, he’s cute, but it’s not him. It’s the way the baby is looking at him. You can tell the baby feels secure with him. That’s hot.”

As an impressionable young teenager—I was 17—I [thought], “I’m going to remember this.” Why do all women seem to resonate with a guy who makes vulnerable people feel secure? What is it about that? I think that’s really interesting.

We are at our best, gentlemen, when we make people around us feel secure. That’s it. It’s very interesting, too, because let’s go back to the Garden of Eden. Do you remember the job that Adam was given—specifically Adam? Do you remember what his job was? “Keeper of the garden.” He was the protector of the garden. He was the one in charge of cultivating what was inside of the garden.

This is uniquely given to the man as a rule. Women can do it, but we’re made for it. What I’m saying in this book is that your garden is your sphere of influence. Everybody within that sphere of influence should feel secure. Anyone vulnerable should feel secure. They should not feel threatened. [I’m] talking about your wife, [I’m] talking about your kids, [I’m] talking about people in your neighborhood. We have failed if we make people less secure. We’ve betrayed our role if they feel less secure.

I’m not just talking about flexing. This is a big problem. Some guys will say, “See, I’m jacked so my wife has to feel secure. Plus, I’ve got this big truck; I’ve got a number of guns.”

Okay, that’s cool, but you know what? You might be jacked. You might spend three hours a day in the gym. You might be handsome. You might have all the coolest stuff. If you make your wife feel insecure—let’s say you flirt with other women every now and then. She feels more insecure because you are there; she’s not attracted to you. In fact, she’ll resent your muscles. Did you know that? All the masculine stuff, if it’s not making her feel more secure, it’s resentful; it’s not attractive.

Conversely, and here’s where it gets to be awesome, you guys, you can be out of shape, you don’t have to have a giant truck, you don’t have to be incredible with guns or ax throwing or whatever. Here’s the thing, you can be all that, if you make your wife feel more secure, if she’s secure around you, you’re attractive to her. That’s a fact. This is the key. There is something instinctive about the way a woman draws out what we’re supposed to be. It’s the keeper of the garden.

Here’s the other thing about being a keeper of the garden: it’s not just protector of the garden. If you really understand a wild garden there is someone who attends to that garden, you cultivate the vulnerable species within that garden are able to survive and flourish and bloom because you are there. they get to flourish and bloom, species that were they in the wild would be choked out, would die, but because you’re there they get to bloom and become everything they could have been.

Your wife, your kids, the vulnerable around you get to flourish because you treat your sphere of influence like it’s a garden. You are there to protect the vulnerable.

You should tell your sons this, by the way. Do you have sons? Tell them this is their role because guys have no idea. They have no vision for masculinity. But when you tell them this, even is they’re nine years old, they’ll [say], “Oh, got it.” It also actually lights a fire inside, like, “I’ve got it. I can do this. Even with my words I can make people more secure.”

There are guys, by the way, who will [say], “Oh, I defend our household. If any intruder came in, I would kill for my wife.”

I read one guy saying, “Yes, I used to pat myself on the back for being somebody who would defend the home if I had to. Then I realized that doesn’t happen very often. Most of the time the intruder is me with my words, with my sarcasm, the way I don’t respond to my wife.”

You can curse your wife without saying anything. You can just pause for a second and it’s a curse. You know this. Tone of voice; I’ve had to work on my tone of voice for 33 years, but I’ve gotten better.

But see, you’re the threat. This guy said, “I realize that I’m actually the threat that needs to be defended against. My wife needs defense against me and my attitude.”

You know what also makes women feel insecure, and Adam is guilty of this, passivity. If you are not engaged, if she doesn’t think that you’d be willing to engage, that makes her feel insecure.

There’s toxic masculinity on one side, which is the abusive kind. The other toxic masculinity is toxic passivity. If you talk to counselors, they’ll tell you they see that more often than anything else. It’s just “Yes, dear; yes, dear. I just want to focus on my iPad. Yes, dear.” I get it. But we have to fight that. That makes women feel insecure, too.

[Studio]

Ann: You’re listening to FamilyLife Today. We’ve been listening to a talk Brant Hansen gave on the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise. Honestly, I just wanted to take a quick minute to jump in and say, “Whatever you are going through today—listen to this: you aren’t alone.” I don’t know if you know this, but Dave and I have a team at FamilyLife Today ready to pray for you. It’s this incredible honor and privilege to lift your name up to God.

If you need prayer, please, please reach out to us. You can head on over to FamilyLife.com/prayforme. Again, that’s FamilyLife.com/prayforme, and tell us how we can pray for you. We’re not kidding. Dave and I have a prayer team specifically dedicated to praying for our listeners, praying for you.

Dave: You are not alone. We would love to lift you up by name. Again, go to FamilyLife.com/prayforme, and we will pray for you today.

Ann: This is FamilyLife Today, and we’ve been listening to a talk Brant Hansen gave on the Love Like You Mean It cruise. Why don’t men step in and step up?

Dave: I think Brant is going to tell us, because we’re only halfway through this talk. So, we’re going to go back and hear more from Brant Hansen.

[Recorded Message]

Brant: When I was writing this, The Men We Need, we had this ruckus outside our house. We live in this townhouse. It was like 11 o’clock at night, and we could hear it. We’re up in the second story of our townhouse going to bed. There were a bunch of people wrestling or tussling or raising a ruckus outside, a big group of people out in the street.

Carolyn was looking out the window. She said, “What’s going on? This is making me nervous.” I said, “Don’t worry. Let’s just turn the noise maker up louder, and then we’ll be fine.” [Laughter] “Problem solved.” I was lying there, and she got up again and went downstairs. I was in the bedroom by myself. She was obviously nervous.

I said to myself, “Brant, good grief. You are lying in bed.” So, I put clothes on. I went downstairs, and I went out the front door to confront this big group of whoever. As I went out the door, you guys, they dispersed. I promise you, I don’t even think they saw me. [Laughter] I don’t. I think I happened to walk out at the exact right time.

But I went out the door to confront them, and they dispersed. Then I turned around, and I start heading back into the door, and my wife said, “That was hot.” [Laughter]

I told her “I don’t think they even saw me. They were dispersing; I didn’t even do anything.” And she said, “Yes, but you were willing to. That’s hot.”

You know what was really weird? I was working on the radio in south Florida. We got hit by several hurricanes in a row years ago. But I had women calling in—one woman called in and said, “You know what? My husbands out putting up the shutters, and I find that incredibly attractive.” Putting up the shutters to protect the home. I [thought], “Really? That’s interesting.”

Then I was flooded, you guys, with calls. All these women said, “Me, too. It’s the strangest thing. I saw my husband put up shutters, and said, ‘Wow!’” It’s because you’re showing that you’re willing to do it. Are you guys tracking with me?

I think this is the core, this “Keeper of the Garden” thing is what we’re made for. I really do. We need to communicate this to people clearly (younger guys), so they know what it is. I didn’t even think about this. We have a boy and a girl. They’re grown up now, but our son was picking on our daughter. His name is Justice. Julia was in a back room saying, “Justice, stop it. Justice.”

I [thought], “Enough.” I went back there. I said, “Justice, do you realize you are the problem? I have to defend your sister against you. You’re supposed to defend your sister. You are her defender. You defend the vulnerable. She’s your little sister, and I have to come defend her against you. You betrayed your role.”

He was nine. That came out of my mouth. I wasn’t even thinking that much. I said, “Yes, you’re supposed to….” You know what? I honestly don’t think we had an incident after that. He got it. [Snapping Sound]

Little boys will get this. Men get this, because it’s what we’re made for. Being a keeper of the garden doesn’t mean that you own anyone. It means you are here to make people secure. Not bad guys. See, by defending the vulnerable against people who are genuinely evil, you make them more secure because you are here.

That’s what I tell younger guys: “You are 21 or 24 years old. You’ve got testosterone going crazy. You’re at your athletic peak. You are strong. You’re fast. That’s supposed to be so you can defend the vulnerable, not prey on them.”

If they see a young guy in the neighborhood who’s 21 years old, maybe a group of them, what should happen, if they know what their role is? People should [say], “Oh, man. I’m so glad they’re here. The neighborhood is safer because these guys are here.”

Instead, guys don’t know what they’re supposed to be doing, so they prey on people. They’re not given a vision. An even bigger problem with young guys—you know this, too—[is] they’ll shut themselves in with video games and porn and not do anything in life because they haven’t been given a vision for how they are supposed to live, like, “Look, you have a role in this world.”

I asked a question in the book. I pitched a hypothetical guy named Jake. You should ask—if you teach kids or you teach young guys or older guys, ask them—this question: “Let’s say Jake is indoors all day. He plays video games; he doesn’t bother anybody; and he’s happy doing that. He spends his days, his weeks, his years as a shut-in playing video games. He’s not bothering anybody. Is there anything wrong with that?”

Most people in our culture can’t articulate what’s wrong with that if he’s happy and he’s not bothering anybody; but we can. We say, “Yes, there’s something wrong with that! Jake, we needed you out here. God gave you skills and abilities and talents in a context for a reason. We’re missing out on you because you’re in there. We needed you.”

There is an actual vision for masculinity here. Our society suffers when people don’t know what it is. We have to articulate that to people and tell them, “This is our role.”

By the way, let me give you an example. This guy was in the news. There’s a gentleman climbing up, from story to story. The person dangling there is four years old. It’ a four-year-old boy. This was on the streets of Paris; it wasn’t that long ago. You may have seen this in the news. He’s dangling up there, [and] there is a crowd on the street saying, “Oh, my goodness. The poor little boy.” They were gasping, saying, “What’s going to happen? This poor little boy. Oh, no, no, no! What’s happening?”

This immigrant from Mali—this was in Paris—said, “I’ll take care of this.” He started climbing up and swinging up from one to the next like getting up to the next balcony. He got all the way up and got on the balcony and pulled the kid to safety. Now, that’s pretty cool. I’ll ask women, “Is he attractive?” [They answer], “Oh, yes!” You can’t even see him. [Laughter] It doesn’t matter. See what I mean.

But I’ll tell you what, there’s another guy involved in this story. You can’t see him, because he’s just inside the sliding glass doors on the floor with that boy. That’s the boy’s dad who was playing video games. I love video games, so there is nothing wrong implicitly with video games; but I’ll tell you what, you ask a woman, “Is that guy attractive?” [They will answer], “No. He’s a failure. He’s not protecting the vulnerable.”

That guy, the guy from Mali—I thought this was cool; they actually gave him citizenship and an honorary medal from the president of France—I thought that was cool—for doing what he did.

Here’s another example. I think it’s interesting because those stories resonate in the media because people think, “Oh, that’s what men are for [to] make us more secure. Yes, right.” That should be our indicator.

I didn’t write the book—I tell guys, “I’m not writing this book so that you can be attractive to women. I want you to know there is a God-given reason for what you are given as a man, and it’s beautiful, and it’s good. Even if nobody else can articulate it, we know what it is, and it’s good. Your strength is good.”

It’s all about being a keeper of the garden, that original job, which Adam failed to do. Remember, he was with Eve. By the way, I always thought when Satan was tempting Eve that Adam was far away somewhere naming animals or something. I don’t know what he was doing. Right?

You read it in context—check this out; read it today, [and] it sounds like he’s right there with her the whole time; right there, and he does nothing. He’s supposed to defend this area from the enemy, and he does nothing. He can’t even get fruit himself. She has to hand it to him. I don’t know if he’s lying down or what. He’s so passive.

Then, when they’ve sinned—maybe you remember this, God comes into the garden, and what does He say? “Adam, where are you?” [Genesis 3:9, Paraphrased] “I made you the keeper of the garden. Where are you? You were supposed to defend this place. She was supposed to flourish because of you. Everything was supposed to [flourish]. This is your job.”

I feel like, in my field, that whatever I do, I want to defend the vulnerable. That’s who I want to be. I think that’s when we are at our best.

[Studio]

Ann: You’ve been listening to FamilyLife Today, and we’ve been listening to a talk that Brant Hansen gave on the Love Like You Mean It cruise. As Brant was wrapping up this segment of the talk—there’s more to come, I got teary because of the significance that God had called men into the importance of their role. I’m not sure why it makes me teary, because I long for that for women, for friends, for the garden. You know?

Dave: I think what’s happening is, Brant is tapping into the human DNA that God has put in every single one of us, to be the men, be the women, He’s called us to be. I think we resonate when we hear it right from Scripture that we, as men, are called to cultivate the garden, to protect the garden, to protect the women in the garden.

I love Brant Hansen because it’s so fresh. So often, you think a man is this strong, manly, motorcycle-riding tough guy. I’m not saying that can’t be a part of being a man, but Brant says, “That’s not what a man is. It’s defending the vulnerable; it’s protecting the weak. It’s being tender, yet strong.” I think that’s what resonates with you.

Ann: Maybe so. A couple of weeks ago, we heard the story of our five-year-old grandson [who] was on a playground with his three-year-old sister, and she fell through this wood. The five-year-old, Bryce, held onto her and said, “Go get help! Go get help!” He held onto her arms and held her up, so she didn’t fall through. He kept saying, “I’m right here. I’m right here, Autumn. It’s okay.” [Laughter]

When that happened, I got teary, too, because I thought, “Yes, that does resonate with me for the man to be the protector.” And women, we’re protecting our kids and so forth, but there is something about [how] God has designated men to protect.

Dave: Yes, I think when we live out our God-given identity as men, and even as women, everyone tears up, because everyone sees: “This is what a man is created to do. This is what a woman is created to do,” and it’s inspiring.

Boy, we’re only halfway through Brant’s talk. The whole room on the cruise, all of us men, were sitting there. It was pretty quiet.

Ann: Was it?

Dave: Yes, because I think we all thought, “He is speaking truth from the Word of God. He’s giving us a vision of what a man is, basically, from what Adam failed to do in the Garden and what Jesus does.” We were inspired to walk out of that ballroom and become and be the men God called us to be.

I tell you what. You’ve only heard half the talk, so we’re going to come back tomorrow and hear the rest of Brant’s message on the Love Like You Mean It cruise.

But let me tell you, like we said earlier, you need to be on the cruise next year. You don’t want to be hearing cruise talks on FamilyLife Today later. You want to be in the room, enjoying the sun, enjoying time away with your spouse; but also being challenged to be the man and the woman, the husband, wife, mom and dad, who God has called [you] to be, so go to FamilyLifeToday.com and sign up.

Shelby: I’m Shelby Abbott, and you’ve been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson with Brant Hansen on FamilyLife Today.

Brant’s written a book called The Men We Need: God’s Purpose for the Manly Man, the Avid Indoorsman, or Any Man Willing to Show Up. He’s great with titles, isn’t he? He’s amazing at that. You can get your copy right now by going online to FamilyLifeToday.com, or you can click on the link in the show notes. Or feel free to give us a call at 800-358-6329 to request your copy of Brant Hansen’s book, The Men We Need. Again, the number is 800-“F” as in family, “L” as in life, and then the word, “TODAY.”

Dave Wilson is right. You can head over to FamilyLifeToday.com and click on the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise banner to get more information and sign up for sailing this coming February. Right now, if you sign up before September the 30th, you’re going to save $400 per stateroom. That’s right. Head over to FamilyLifeToday.com to get all the details that you need. Just click on the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise banner.

Now, tomorrow, we’re going to hear the other half of Brant Hansen’s talk from the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise last year. He’s going to talk about godly manhood, emphasizing loyalty over emotions, practical faith practices, and of course, spiritual growth. That’s tomorrow. We hope you’ll join us. On behalf of Dave and Ann Wilson, I’m Shelby Abbott. We will see you back next time for another edition of FamilyLife Today.

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